Nutrition/nutrient Geek Thread
Alrighty, I’ll kick it off 
I know there’s one or two of you keen to get your geek on 
Made another batch of chicken bone broth over the last 2 days.
I added some whole cumin, pepper, salt and a sundried chilli to the simmer pot with the onion and chook.
Chook flesh removed after an hour or so (and stored in the fridge for salads), bones cartilage and skin returned to the stock for another 24hrs of brew time.
I’ve had 2 mugs so far and it’s tasty!
Ive got boys who train until fairly late most nights so at least once a week I need to make Pasta Bolognese and whack it in the crockpot so people can serve themselves as required between 5pm and 10pm. I’ve been spiking that mix with about 2 cups of the stock to up the nutritional value of the spag bol. I picked up some large size ice cube trays (as in each cube is big) to freeze the stock then pop the cubes into a freezer bag for convenient use in these situations. Keen to see if that works well.
Next job is making my first batch of sauerkraut. I’m going to do one with regular cabbage one with red 
Exciting!
Now I need good ideas for getting the family to eat it. Goes well with….?
Sauerkraut - the borf says it’s good with chicken and mashed potato, or make sarma with it!
Sauerkraut - the borf says it’s good with chicken and mashed potato, or make sarma with it!
What’s Sarma, Billy?????
* don’t worry, just googled it!!!!! Well there ya go, I never knew they were called that!!!!!
Alrighty, I’ll kick it off
I know there’s one or two of you keen to get your geek on
Woo consider this Nutrient Geek checked in!
Made another batch of chicken bone broth over the last 2 days.
Great timing I just cooked my weekly bone broth last night so could snap a photo of it’s gelled goodness when I pulled it out of the fridge this morning
Next job is making my first batch of sauerkraut. I’m going to do one with regular cabbage one with red
How exciting! Once you make you’re own you’ll never go back to store bought. Who thought such a nutrient/probiotic dense food could be so cheap, simple and yummy!
As for how to use it I add some daily to my lunch salad. I let mine ferment until it is fairly sour/tart so the juices are actually a really nice dressing. It also goes really well as a side to meat/stir fry dishes providing a nice crunch texture to meals and it’s also a good palate cleanser. One of my guilty little post dinner snacks is a sweet potato with a spoonful of sauerkraut and home made mayo (funny how your tastes/craving adjust once you’re a fat burner/keto adapted)
I made the mistake of packing little jars of my sauerkraut for my parents. Mum absolutely loves the stuff and has it with everything. Even Dad who is a fussy eater will add it to meals so I’m sure if you get your brew right you won’t have to twist your families arms!
Just remember to not heat the sauerkraut anymore than luke warm as any hotter kills off the good stuff. (well you could have it hot as you still get the health benefits of cabbage just not the goodies you grew over the ferment)
Pulling my recipe for basic sauerkraut over from the other thread. Obviously once you’ve got this down pat you can start experimenting with different mixtures of vegetables/spices to vary your sauerkraut ferment.
I’m gonna have to give the sauerkraut a go!!!!! What’s ya recipe?????
I’m actually down there on Friday for a wedding! Even with my appetite I’m not sure I can knock over a pork knuckle and a wedding feast + drinks
Good man, with your culinary skills I’m sure you’ll manage with super complex sauerkraut making!
I kind of wing it without a recipe each time so I’ll go through the basic method off the top of my head hopefully I don’t poison you all:
1: Buy yourself a nice fresh cabbage (organic is better blah blah)
2: Take off the other leaves (keep one to the side)
3: Shred the cabbage into nice thin strips.
4: Load the cut cabbage into a nice big bowl and add some course salt usually around 2-3tbsp for a medium cabbage (non iodised course sea salt or himalayan rock salt)
5: Let it sit for a while then start massaging/squeezing the cabbage for 10mins or so, do it in batches if needed (the texture of the cabbage will change and it will release it’s liquid brine the more of this you get out the better)
6: Once you have finished massaging all of the shredded cabbage and got it nice and moist pack it tightly into a clean glass jar.
7: Put that spare outer leaf you kept over the top of the cabbage and if you want weigh it down (so all of the cabbage is submerged in liquid) with something like a smaller glass jar.
8: Seal the jar with a lid and store the jar in a room temperature dark place (if you ferment other stuff keep some distance between them).
9: Leave it there for at least 3 weeks (this changes depending on the temperature in the house and how big your batch is but it needs time to go through all the stages of growth) you may get some pressure build up and leaking of juices so I put the jar in a big bowl to start off with. You’ll notice the colour change and hopefully some bubbling. The cabbage will hopefully stay submerged the whole time if not you may need to press it down with the jar a few times to prevent any mould growing. When you think it might be ready give it a taste. It should have the familiar “sour” taste to it and no longer taste/smell “cabbagey”. If it’s not ready yet seal it back up and leave it another week and test again.
10: If it tastes how you like move it to the fridge.
11: Enjoy with reckless abandon (actually no not too much to start with as your guts may need some adjustment time to the flood of probiotics a daily serve is many times more potent than a yakult or inner health plus)
So there’s a whole bunch of things I’d love to discuss but figured I’d start off with a food diary for today which is probably a fairly typical day for me.
Meal 1
A big mug of bone broth with a poached free range egg.
My meal 1 varies on how hungry I am. During my whole 30 introduction to “paleo” stage I ate eat 3 large meals a day often starting with a big stir fry of veges with a few scrambled free range eggs another source of protein such as beef mince. In recent times my appetite has regulated and I can easily intermittent fast until 12-1pm. As I have no desires to lose any weight I still try to force myself to have something most mornings that provides me with additional nutrients.
Meal 2
More often than not I pack myself a BIG salad for lunch.
This is all the stuff I put in my salad for today: Baby Spinach, Kale, Home made Sauerkraut, Brazil Nuts (2 for my daily dose of Selenium), 1/2 Avocado, Cucumber, Carrot, Baked then cooled potato (for some resistant starch), Baked purple sweet potato (this stuff is like crack/caramel to me), a protein in this case roast free range chicken but could also be beef, lamb, tuna, topped with my home made mayo! 
Meal 3
Nothing too fancy for dinner tonight. Heading away for a few days so needed to clean the fridge out.
Ended up having Atlantic Wild Salmon on a bed of cauliflower rice with sauteed zuchinni/snow peas/kale/mushrooms with a sneaky couple of purple sweet potatoes (and mayo which didn’t make the photo)
Nice. I like this thread as it does lead to some body hacking things.
Can I ask how you make your kombucha? I’m keen to try to make them, but not certain that I can get it right from regular ‘net instructions.
Unfortunately I’m not big on detail so it does get a little hard for me to get into like, high details stuff, like info on Paleo etc etc…. which is why I found the slow carb/4 Hour body diet pretty good as it’s kinda low on detail but you can get more detail with it too…
Will post a little later on my dietary habits, but safe to say I’ve gained alot of weight from my recent NZ trip.
Nice. I like this thread as it does lead to some body hacking things.
Can I ask how you make your kombucha? I’m keen to try to make them, but not certain that I can get it right from regular ‘net instructions.
Will post a little later on my dietary habits, but safe to say I’ve gained alot of weight from my recent NZ trip.
Welcome Grunge, cool feel free to hit us up with some biohacky tips. Keen to hear more about your day to day diet and if you’ve seen my NZ trip report whilst I didn’t gain any weight I certainly still enjoyed my food over there so know where you’re coming from!
Would be happy to get you started in the witchcraft that is Kombucha! I’ll keep it fairly basic but if you want me to expand on anything just let me know.
How I brew Kombucha
1. The first thing you need is a SCOBY (Symbiotic Colony Of Bacteria and Yeast) I got my first one off ebay (try to get a fresh organic one) but once you start brewing you become overrun by the bloody things (each ferment produces a new one)
A couple of quick notes, always handle the SCOBY with clean hands coated in a layer of white vinegar or kombucha. Also never let it come in contact with metal (so don’t use metal spoons or tongs etc)
2. You will also need some starter tea. This is just a previously brewed kombucha which has been let ferment a little longer (the longer it ferments the more vinegary it gets) The purpose of the starter tea is to start your brew off slightly acidic which prevents nasty things like mould
3. Other than those two things you need Black tea bags(I use Aldi’s organic one), White Sugar (don’t worry it’s for the SCOBY to eat not you) a glass jar and water.
4. Onto the process (ask if you need me to expand) I’ll be using ratios for a 1 gallon (3.8L) brew as that’s my standard.
5. Boil water on the stove and let it boil for 5/10mins to kill off anything in there
6. Turn the heat off and mix in 1 cup of sugar
7. Once dissolved add 8 teabags of black tea. Leave the teabags in until the water has completely cooled to room temp.
8. Transfer the water to a clean glass jar and add the Scoby and 2 cups of starter tea.
9. Cover the top of the jar with something breathable (in my case I use a clean chux cloth with a rubber band
10. Store jar in a dark room temperature cupboard and leave it to brew for at least a week. You will probably notice a new scoby growing at the top.
11. After a week start taste testing (I use a straw and cover the top with my finger to suction a small bit out) It’s up to you how sweet/tart you like your brew. The more tart it is the more sugar has been consumed by the SCOBY. After a month it will have probably consumed all of the sugar and you will have Kombucha Vinegar.
12. When you are happy with the taste carefully remove the SCOBY/S and transfer the brew from the big jar into glass bottles (run it through a strainer if the little solid bits worry you (they are fine to consume)
13. This is where you can get fancy during the 2nd Ferment. You can make pretty much any combination of flavors by adding fruit, spices, juices etc to the bottle. Seal the bottles with airproof lids and let them ferment for a few days at room temperature (this allows carbonation to build up making the Kombucha fizzy) This site has a few flavour ideas (I actually just enjoy mine as plain old Kombucha) http://www.culturesforhealth.com/flavoring-bottling-kombucha
14. Once you have hit the desired fizzyness level move the bottles to the fridge.
15. Enjoy! start slow though and build up the amount you drink each day
Hopefully that covers it???
which is why I found the slow carb/4 Hour body diet pretty good as it’s kinda low on detail but you can get more detail with it too…
This! Was going to post in the food thread about it I’ve been doing the basics of slow carb/4hb for a tad over a month now for a few different reasons and it is cracking along nicely!
This! Was going to post in the food thread about it I’ve been doing the basics of slow carb/4hb for a tad over a month now for a few different reasons and it is cracking along nicely!
Come in and make yourself comfy cords any nutrition advice/questions will be at home here
Whilst I’m not fully on board with a few things in the 4HB it’s great to hear you are seeing some good results 
Prety keen to make sauerkraut. Do you think you can make kalekraut? So much kale @ Chill Hill. And eggs. so many eggs!
Prety keen to make sauerkraut. Do you think you can make kalekraut? So much kale @ Chill Hill. And eggs. so many eggs!
Lucky you! I’m buying a bunch of Kale (probably not organic) and a dozen free range eggs every week. I was actually considering growing some small veges (including kale) in a planter box on my shady balcony.
As for kalekraut yeah you could (you can ferment most veges via lacto-fermentation) not sure how the end result would taste possibly strong/bitter?
If you’re overrun with the stuff definitely worth a shot or another alternative is make a cabbage/kale sauerkraut mix.
I’d be interested to hear how it goes!
Edit: Here you go. http://www.culturesforhealth.com/hearty-leafy-green-kraut-recipe
Come in and make yourself comfy cords any nutrition advice/questions will be at home here
Whilst I’m not fully on board with a few things in the 4HB it’s great to hear you are seeing some good results
haha, thanks! Interested on your opinions both good and bad on 4HB, for sure. You’ve already proved yourself to be a guru in your previous posts on the topic 
As I said, I’m doing the basics of it. I downloaded the book (for free of course) and read through it. There are lots of additional things you can do (supplements, taking cold showers etc) and I’m not doing any of those. The dude who wrote it is also pretty big on Sauerkraut, so I thought you’d be a fan!
The main benefits for me (apart from losing excess kgs - just over 5kgs in the first month) is the structure of it really helps me to make better decisions, and I’m also learning to eat things that I would never, ever otherwise have bothered to learn to eat or cook….these being mainly lentils and different beans.
I can now make a pretty nice bean mash, refried beans and put lentils in a thai paneng curry. Not being able to have potato, rice or noodles as filling staples has forced this and I think it is a good change. Now when I eventually re-introduce those foods I will only ever be having much smaller portions (probably 1/4 of what I used to).
It has also made me realise how much crap I ate before, and I’ve been teaching myself to drink more and more water for a while now and this diet has upped the ante there, too. I drink water all day and then maybe have a cup of tea after dinner (but am happy to drink more water instead, too)
Cheat day is also a big positive for me, I’d never have been able to get started on this without the lure of cheat day and I really don’t think eating dairy, bread, potato etc one day a week will ever do too much harm….but psychologically it is a total winner.
One day a week to be a normal person and eat cereal for breakfast and have some potato with dinner is great!
haha, thanks! Interested on your opinions both good and bad on 4HB, for sure. You’ve already proved yourself to be a guru in your previous posts on the topic
Great to read about your results cords, Just getting ready for work but when I get some time I’ll definitely hit you up with my thoughts as a few of the things you specifically mentioned are my qualms. (keeping in mind I’m a snowboarding computer technician and no dietician, just a obsessive researcher!)
haha, thanks! Interested on your opinions both good and bad on 4HB, for sure. You’ve already proved yourself to be a guru in your previous posts on the topic
Great to read about your results cords, Just getting ready for work but when I get some time I’ll definitely hit you up with my thoughts as a few of the things you specifically mentioned are my qualms. (keeping in mind I’m a snowboarding computer technician and no dietician, just a obsessive researcher!)
Obsessive researcher. Love that description. That would be me also.
For me the searching started to try and find out what the hell was wrong with me, and how I could help myself get well - thank god I did because the medicos have been very little help!
It’s turned into an obsession of the nutrient geek kind
It’s taken a sideline turn this week. A very good friend has been diagnosed with thyroid cancer and is having surgery Tuesday…he has expressed an interest to attack it with a holistic approach. Thankfully I’ve already done a lot of that research so will pass on info to him, and do a bit of food prep for him also. But if anyone has any excellent suggestions to include I’d be thrilled to hear them.
Kombucha - I haven’t done this yet. My Mum used to brew this stuff back in the 70s when she was on the Pritikin Diet, but it’s not something I’ve ever done. I might try this also. Now to search out a scoby - all my FB friends offering them are interstate or overseas!
Butter coffee update: I went out to lunch with some ski friends yesterday to the Naked Fig in Swanbourne, they have great food on the menu and use organics where possible. I got a fabulous Beet Booster juice with ginger, carrot, beetroot and some other stuff. And finished the meal with a butter coffee (a small one)....it’s the first time Ive actually seen it on the menu anywhere. I didn’t really need or want a coffee at the time, but I wanted to try it and see how it compared to mine. It was more buttery, obviously they use more butter in theirs than I do, and they don’t have MCT oil in it.
OK have made a few spare minutes at work so I can ramble on a little bit more about nutrition and in particular my qualms with the 4HD (only because cords asked!)
First I should state that I think “paleo perfectionism” and “choosing a team” is a problem that seems to haunt the community. My approach was to use paleo/primal/bulletproof/perfecthealthdiet/4HB/the list goes on as a framework and adapt it over time into a lifestyle that seems to work for me best via research and experimentation.
I believe it’s as simple as “eat real foods” and try to concentrate more on all the things we can eat (meat/fish/vegetables/fruit/fats) rather than what we can’t (more advised not to)
Having said that I think if most people could rule out grains/sugars/processed foods from their diet they would be 80% of the way there the remainder is just fine tuning and getting as many nutrients as possible.
The most important thing is find something that works for you If you feel like you are getting the most out of your body and have great health there’s no reason to change what you are doing.
With that said here’s my personal qualms with the 4HB diet (keeping in mind I haven’t read the whole book just cliff notes but a few things stood out) Generally it’s pretty solid (it is based on all the frameworks I mentioned above) but let’s go through Tim’s 5 “rules”
RULE 1: AVOID “WHITE” CARBOHYDRATES:
Much of the diets mentioned above achieve a lot of there gains from being lower in carbs than the average diet. By ruling grains/sugars/processed foods out your daily carb count is automatically cut to pretty low levels.
I think the 4HB approach is a bit drastic and “carb phobic” at the cost of nutrients. There is absolutely nothing wrong with Potatoes/Sweet Potatoes and to rule them out you are missing out on a lot of nutrients/vitamins/fiber and resistant starch. Unless you have an obesity problem and the rest of your diet is good then these “safe starches” aren’t going to do you any harm when eaten in moderation and obviously not once transformed into fries/chips cooked in bad oils.
White rice is another carb that is fine to eat in moderation. It doesn’t offer much in the way of nutrients but to knock back a sushi roll would be silly.
RULE 2: EAT THE SAME FEW MEALS OVER AND OVER AGAIN:
My simple question to this is why? we have such amazing foods to work with why restrict it to being plain and boring. This stipulation in my mind makes it less likely to be adopted as a lifelong lifestyle change.
RULE 3: DON’T DRINK CALORIES:
Generally I agree, but I’m not going to guilt somebody for drinking BP coffee or a smoothie occasionally.
RULE 4: DON’T EAT FRUIT:
This continues the “carb phobic” way of thinking. I used to demolish fruit at least a couple of pieces a day and it was my strongest craving when I first converted to this way of eating. Once again I see absolutely no problem with eating fruit in moderation and not allowing it once again makes it harder to commit to long term. FYI I pretty much don’t eat fruit at home anymore but might have fruit salad once a week when I visit my parents.
RULE 5: TAKE ONE DAY OFF PER WEEK:
Haha this is the one that really annoys me. This scheduled 1 day a week where you go nuts and binge on everything ignoring the physical health side of it just sets up all kinds of mental issues. It basically banishes the other 6 days of eating “the same meals over and over again” to be a hard slog in which you are rewarded once a week with a prize of eating/drinking a bunch of crap that’s really no good for you potentially setting off a bunch of food cravings while you are at it.
The fact that it is justified so your body doesn’t go into “starvation” mode just baffles me. If your body “needs” candy, cake, soft drink, processed foods and oils to function then there must be something major missing from the core diet!
Doesn’t it make more sense to enjoy your “healthy” meals each day and if something comes up where you have to have an off plan meal or a big night out then have it and try not to feel to guilty about it knowing that you’ll soon be back to your enjoyable healthy way of eating. Importantly days off aren’t scheduled or forced in any way they just come up from time to time. There’s all sorts of 80/20 rules out there (eat well 80% of the time and give yourself 20% leeway) and I definitely agree that you shouldn’t try to be perfect all the time (the stress of doing this outweighs the benefits) but you really should be enjoying eating, your cravings will naturally fade over time and it certainly shouldn’t be based on any form of rewards system.
Just as important if you have a meal or 2 or 3 that are “off plan” over the week don’t stress about it as every other meal you are eating is building a strong foundation of health.
Legumes:
Ok this isn’t a rule but having meals based around a food group that is generally accepted as not particularly good for you seems a bit odd. I don’t completely rule legumes out of my life but it’s certainly something that I believe should be eaten only in moderation and even then preferably prepared with traditional methods (soaked/sprouted) which would be a pain in the ass. I won’t get to sciencey on it but the main issue with them is that they contain anti-nutrients (phytates, lectins) and are fairly high in carbs compared to healthier vegetable options. I do eat a fair bit of snow peas and green beans though as they are more pod than seed.
So that’s my thoughts on the 4HB, I’m open for debate and happy to learn as well so if you have anything go for it. Looking back at it now I’ve probably just made it less strict, I’m a big believer in making it a sustainable healthy lifestyle more than a crash diet. Please remember that whatever is working for you and making you happier/healthier than you have ever been is the lifestyle you should stick to no matter what it is and we’ll all be stoked for you!
I’m similar in taking a bit from this and a bit from that and fitting it into my life style.
What I’m doing this week might change next week as I tweak it to better fit me…as I’m still learning.
Yesterday’s lunch, some outstanding mushrooms and a poached egg with truffle oil on a piece of ciabatta - I considered not eating the ciabatta, but in the end went for it. I need to keep the carbs low (weight needs to be lost) but I’m not sweating the small stuff. Going out to lunch doesn’t happen often, and in the end I barely ate dinner - few mouthfuls of cauliflower and I was unable to continue.
It’s a marathon not a sprint.
What works for you is what is important. We are not all the same.